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Trophy Bucks Typical

Illinois Monarch: 202 7/8-inch Trophy Buck

by North American Whitetail Online Staff   |  November 22nd, 2011 209

A look at the Randy Schultz trophy buck taken in southern Illinois.

 

  • Eric

    Nice buck but would have been better if it wasn't killed on a ranch where they see numerous 200 inchers. These ranches and farms are ruining deer hunting in my opinion.

    • Wayne

      This is a buck of a lifetime. Nothing was said about it not being a free range deer, or that it was shot on a fenced ranch. Why is it that you say someone willing to manage their property and give deer time to reach their true potential and maturity ruining deer hunting? Their are deer of this caliber shot all across the United States that people never hear about that where smart enough to avoid hunters until they reached their prime.

    • adecker44

      This buck wasn't shot on a ranch and was taken under fair chase conditions. No one knew this deer was in the area until about 10 days prior…

      • Eric

        It was a ranch. He paid to shoot it. I have killed many big bucks including one over 200 inches and it wasn't on a paid ranch. He shot it on a ranch where someone else did the work. These ranches and farms are ruining hunting…..period.

        • Dan

          Trolling tool Eric!

          • Eric

            LOL

    • john

      this was a free ranging deer, killed in the farmlands of southern illinois.

      • Eric

        Hardly

    • John

      Here kitty kitty kitty…….whack.

    • chris

      If you don't know what you are talking about then you should not say anything at all! This is a wild deer that has had time to grow, not getting shot at 2 years old. This is what Illiniois has to offer if you let deer grow.

      • mike

        When you combine all illinois has to offer(genetics,food,short firearm season,and low bag limits)
        With letting them go so they will grow(Big)…..Then deer like this is what you get.
        If you dont know what your talking about….,,its best just to keep quiet

        although we all are entitled to our opinions,dont state things as Fact if you dont know for a FACT

    • mike

      Good lord Eric,How exactly does it ruin deer hunting?
      As long as those guys are not doing anything that the illinois DNR deems illegal,whats wrong with providing a service to someone willing to pay for said service?
      Do you bash your mechanic for doing everything possible to provide you a quality experience when fixing your car?
      Its all about supply and demand…..nothing wrong with it in my book

      • Mark

        A majority of hunters would agree with Eric. Ranches take away from the integrety of the sport. We aren't talking about fixing cars here so that's a bad analogy. We are talking about wild animals.

    • michael

      u r a fool ur mad cuz u have never got one probably never will. ur just hating on him and for what? were is ur BIG DEER oh u dont have one. just shut up get some money and go get one. STOP KILLING ALL THE BABYS and u will have big ones like that. GOOD KILL RANDY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! HATING AXX HOLE.

      • Knowsall

        That's right. It was a kill. Good kill Randy. Congrats. Now go hunt one.

  • Mike

    Nice buck but a little different hunting in the wild. But still am sure very satisfying. Ur from Virginia I am sure u know how it is.

    • john

      deer was killed in the wild

      • Bill

        I killed one of my cows in the "wild" too. I shook the grain bucket and he came in and I shot him.

  • Tony

    Great buck…..and why people make comments like " ruining deer hunting" or "but a little different hunting in the wild" is really beyond me. This hunter traveled to a state and an area that had the genetics, food and management practices to allow a buck to mature….. he deserves credit for that and the outfitter deserves credit for managing his property in a manner that allows deer to mature and reach there potential. This deer is a deer of a lifetime for any hunter and 1 one in a million deer (200 inch gross B&C typical mainframe are rather rare).
    Congratulations Randy….. great buck.

  • Eric

    Like I said, nice buck but it was a ranch. He paid to shoot it. I have killed many big bucks including one over 200 inches and it wasn't on a paid ranch. He shot it on a ranch where someone else did the work. These ranches and farms are ruining hunting…..period.

    • Pat

      I live and work 30 minutes from this outfitter and it is a completely fenced in property where the deer population is fed ridiculous amounts of supplements in an effort to try and get deer to this size. This is not a fair way to hunt, I think it is absurd that people pay this insane amount of money just so they can claim to have killed a "deer of a lifetime". River to River Outfitters is a joke and people should feel ashamed to take animals that are farm fed/raised just so they can be killed for a magazine article.

      • Todd

        Pat – River to River Outfitters is located in Ewing, Illinois. We have over 4000 acres of fair chase hunting ground none of which is fenced in. I am in total agreement with you over fenced in hunting but this is not what we do. Check out our website, huntriver2river.com, feel free to contact our references.

        • dave

          bucks dont just grow antlers like those,force feeding minerals will do it though

      • John

        Pat, you are also a moron, River to River is legit free ranging whitetails. Just different leased and owned farms that give guys opportunities like this man to hunt midwest whitetails. Since you live 30 minutes away, why dont you drive back by and get your facts straight

      • John

        Pat, you are also a moron, River to River is legit free ranging whitetails. Just different leased and owned farms that give guys opportunities like this man to hunt midwest whitetails. Since you live 30 minutes away, why dont you drive back by and get your facts straight

      • Adam

        Pat you have no idea of what the hell your talking about!! Your lying and you know it!!

    • john

      you are a moron eric. completely free ranging whitetail this guy killed, not everyone is as awesome as you and has great hunting land so they go somewhere they can have a chance at a big whitetail. so what if someone else put the stand up, matter of fact, why dont you come hang a stand for me since you are the best hunter ever

      • Eric

        I wasn't putting the hunter down or at least didn't mean to. I stick by my opinion that these ranches and farms are ruining whitetail hunting. I wasn't bragging. I was just stating a fact that there is land to hunt without paying to shoot fish in a barrel. You sound like a DA. I doubt you can climb a tree.

    • applepickers

      Keep bragging Eric.

      • Eric

        I take it you pay someone to lead the deer to you too.

      • Bill

        Applepickers???? Sort of like cherry pickers. Like they do on farms and ranches. I'm sure that's what you do.

        • applepickers

          I picked cherries for many years, also killed hundreds of deer and none of them were on a fenced in farm, most on public hunting land.Hhow have you done Billie?

    • dave

      you are right these deer schould be elimated from record books

  • Bill

    @Eric: Obviously, YOU ARE THE MAN! Get over yourself. Seriously. You like to hear yourself type (and probably talk too). Give me a specific reason HOW ranches are ruining YOUR hunting. That's stupid. You can't. If you don't want to hunt on a ranch, then don't. I cannot fathom how a ranch is specifically ruining YOUR hunting. I'll bet you are one attention-seeking dude. Geeeeeesssss.

    • Eric

      Land is being leased by these ranches every day. It is only getting worse. Places to hunt for the average Joe are shrinking yearly. This is how it will affect my hunting and the hunting for generations to come. It deminshes skill needed to harvest a big buck by these ranches and farms genetically enhancing and concentratrating high numbers of big bucks. So don't be a DA Bill. Just my opinion.

  • Steve

    Hey Eric how about a picture of your free range Buck. You know the 200 incher. Go ahead and post it so we can give you HELL!!

    • Eric

      I didn't pay to shoot it in a pen.

  • Rob

    Congratulations on a great buck. Have never even seen a rack of that magnitude in the woods. I just shot my 2nd archery buck and it grossed 173, what a rush when everything comes together. Good luck in the future.

  • BOB

    PENNED DEER…WHAT A JOKE…NO CREDIT DESERVED….LEMME TIE ONE TO THE TREE OUT SIDE MY BACK DOOR…SOME THING…BULLSHT

    • applepickers

      Bob, you probably could not hit it if it was tied to a tree.

    • Adam

      They earn there deer by sitting all day long rain or shine, if someone wants to pay to hunt at a place like this then who cares more power to them. It's there money

      • Jake

        EARN??? What a joke……….

  • bob

    lazy assed folks w / money to burn…….

    • Steve

      So let me get this straight >>bob, If you are going fishing, you wouldn't go to a lake that has been stocked, you would rather go to a mud hole? Some people have jobs and can't set on the river bank drinking beer and baiting a hook with ivory soap. Give me the stocked lake any day. Oh yeah>>> bob, that was an analogy. Grow up >>>bob

      • bucdoc 160

        if your to busy to set up your own hunt, scout, do the leg work, then you don't understand real hunting.you need to stay home, make your money, and stop stinking up our woods. if you can't handle the heat, then get out of the kitchen.

  • Todd

    River to River Outfitters is located in Ewing, Illinois. We have over 4000 acres of fair chase hunting ground none of which is fenced in. We are in total agreement with comments over fenced in hunting but this is not what we do. Check out our website, huntriver2river.com, feel free to contact our references.

    • dylan osborn

      i have hunted there and it nothing like you guy think it is it is a hunt and its not fenced in at all so suck it fags who talk bs

  • Stephen

    I have hunted with the owner of this operation and i can say with absolute certainty, none of their property is fenced in. This operation is comprised of a lot of different farms located in different areas, it would be difficult to fence them all in. They have great hunting because they have a minimum standard for deer to be shot and they do whats best by having the farmers plant corn and soy beans. And in case you idiots that are bashing haven't heard, Illinois is loaded with giant bucks. Get serious people and stop hating because you dont want to spend the money to go somewhere to have an opportunity at a big whitetail. And if you have a place on your own where you can kill a big one, more power to you ,but dont bash dudes that dont

  • JOSH MARTIN

    If "TODD" is charging hunters to hunt on his property,he more than likely raised deer in fences at some part of his herd life. And of course he will say there wild and free. You can 'Artificially Incentamait ' fenced in doe's then let them free rage after they have been bread. Five years later ,oh look there's a 200 inch buck.Tampering with mother nature is fake hunting.This first started in Texas,imagine that huh,everything's bigger in Texas.THESE GUYS CHARGE A SHIT LOAD OF MONEY for FEED LOT HYBRED DEER.
    BILL JORDAN ,LEE AND TIFFANY ,KISKYS all raise ear tag deer.Then release them on their 5000 acre's and hunt them.Thats the truth.If your making a living off deer hunting you gonna say and do anything to make you money.

    • Todd

      Josh – spell check much? Once again – check our references. No pens, no artificial insemination, no ear tags. We don't kill 200 inch deer everyday but we are proud of this one. Thanks for mentioning us in such high company.

      • applepickers

        Josh can not spell and probably not hit anything either.

        • todd

          if you look close you can see the hole where the ear tag was. LOL

          • Todd

            I repeat this is all fair chase hunting. No tags and no fences are used in our hunts.

  • Tony

    I cannot believe some of the idiotic posts bashing this deer, the hunter and the outfitter. It's amazing how ignorant this folks are how they have no grasp of the facts (and apparently make things up). I can only assume envy and jealousy are the reasons for making things up in order to demean someone elses accomplishments. By their standard no one should go on an out of state hunt with an outfitter. Do they think that NAW would profile a deer that was shot behind a higfh fence…. morons.

    • Eric

      accomplishments?

  • Todd

    By the way, at River to River we killed a 173, 175, and 176 the same week as the 202. Chris and I are just hard working guys trying to provide a good, fair chase hunt. Bash if you will, those who have hunted with us will not. Happy Holidays

    • Eric

      You have to pay out the ass to hunt there. Which leaves most hunters out. This is the problem with this ranch hunting. It is introducing greed into hunting. Meaning the farms and ranches want to make big money. The chances of killing a buck of this caliber is far greater on on of these "farms" thus less skill needed.

      • Adam

        Dude i have read your post and you are a dumbass!!! nothing futher

  • drake

    Throw me in a free hunt there, I'll be the judge

  • Steven

    I am just shocked at all the negativity and outright lies being written here.

    I know for a fact that the Kisky's and Lee and Tiffany do not raise deer to shoot or release artificially inseminated does. That's an outright lie.

    Matter of fact I just sent Chris an email about doing some late season hunting. I will support hard working outfitters like this!!!

    Those of you running your mouth should be ashamed. God doesn't bless a person who lies and gossips!!!!

  • jason

    Dont mind what everybody else is saying. That deer is a monster! It doesnt matter if it was on a fenced ranch. Your the one who put it on the ground and thats all that matters.

    • Eric

      It is a monster. A very fine trophy. It is still my opinion that these ranches and farms will ruin whitetail hunting.

  • Rick Ford

    I have mixed feelings about using outfitters…maybe because I could not possibly afford one. The truth of the matter is, that whitetail hunting has been a big money operation for the better part of 20-30 years now. The troubling thing is, if you don't own, lease, or use an outfitter such as this, your chances of killing a quality buck are exponentially lower. Public land is scarce and crowded and generally managed to support numbers of deer. Having said all this, I don't care if a hunter hunts land that has been managed for trophy deer.

  • Rick Ford

    I don't even care if it's high fenced as long as it's a large tract of land. As long as the deer are wild, it's hard to let the air out of a mature buck. I just can't help feeling like eventually, hunting in the United States will mirror hunting in the UK and Europe where only the elite are allowed (or can afford) to hunt. I can't blame landowners for wanting to profit from their deer herds, nor can I blame outfitters for making money where there is money to be made. I just wish trophy whitetail hunting wasn't getting that "elite-ist" feel to it.
    Congratulations on a great deer Randy. If such a deer exists on public land, maybe I'll have my picture on here soon too.

  • Johnny

    Wow ya all kinda sound like school kids, "my daddy can beat your daddy up. No way my daddy is bigger….." The point of the matter is he got an awsome deer, He spent time enjoying the outdoors. A most excellent deer Randy, good job. With that being said; I am a big proponent of free range deer and hopefully his was a free range deer. When I can finally afford to go on some guided hunts, that will be one of my many checklist items in picing an outfitter. I live near enough to chicago and can only hunt public land, I've been hunting since I was five yrs old, hunting archery since '96' and have only one real wall hanger. And I'm no great white hunter, just your average joe. For all you school kids, get out and hunt only public land and then start argueing in the school yard. Always, ALWAYS, remember hunters must stick together to protect our privileges. We are a vanishing breed.

    • Eric

      I agree hunters should stick together. It is just coming down to who ever has the money kills the big deer….or at least has a very big advantage. This includes all the "professionals" on TV.

  • Mark

    I know a man who worked on a hunting deer ranch in northern IL.He told me that they do every thing in there power and money is no poblem in taking care of the whitetail deer on there ranch.They get all the feed and minerals they want from the first day they are born. Also, if the buck has genetic deformed rack that buck is put down. They want nothing but quality bucks on there ranch for them high paying city slickers, who don't have any skill or idea how to hunt a wild free range whitetaill buck.The deer have been around people so much from day one, when they see someone they think of food. Not danger and run, my friend said sometimes the deer will walk up 20yrds or so from you thinking you got food for them. My complaint is these bucks should not be aloud in the record books period.

    • Eric

      Another good point. These deer aren't truly wild and "free ranging". They are nice deer but should not be in any record books…..period.

  • Adam

    First of all, congratulations to Randy on his great deer and being covered in North American White Tail. It is sad that you have to see the negative comments above, especially from those who are contending that it was a high-fenced or raised deer. Too bad people can post whatever they want without knowing River 2 River. I've hunted there since 2007. Chris is a friend of mine, and I've become good friends with Todd. They choose to run River 2 River in a traditional manner.

    The reason hunters pay money to hunt at River 2 River is because they have the opportunity to kill a deer of this caliber, thanks to the work done before the season with food plots, deer stand placement, trail cams, etc. Chris works hard to ensure that his hunters have the best experience possible, as evidenced by the number of hunters that return to River 2 River year after year. His rates are lower than the big names and he can offer similar results on less acreage.

    For those who think River 2 River is high-fenced, call Chris for a personal tour. I'll guarantee you are wrong, or I'll pay for your next hunt.

    • Steve

      Very nice deer. It should not have been covered in North American Whitetail or be allowed in any record books. High fence or not, it isn't a true trophy when raised under unnatural circumstances and shot by a paying hunter. There was no skill or work needed.

  • Adam

    Actually no i haven't john, i've hunted deer with chris for the last 20 yrs and have a 147' 10 point.
    You can read the last post on this page and take me up on this offer if you think this about River 2 River. Everyone is entitled to an opinion, but some just make fools of thereselveswhen they do!!

    • John

      Oh ….Chris' friend. So you do shoot half tame deer and let him do all the work. "Thereselves" isn't a word DA.

  • ryan

    its just an outfitter, not fenced in

  • Ransom

    Ok, lets get one thing straight. Why has deer hunting become a business? My favorite sport/hobby has been ruined by people like outfitters and "out of staters". I have killed a 200 inch deer myself on free range territory in southern illinois. So before you want to go talking trash about show us your deer, talk it somewhere else. One more thing, come around my hometown where three guys have started outfitting and go around and ask the locals how they like those guys…… Oh wait I already know, they are hated and every story you hear is negative. So to all you out of staters and outfitters, thanks for making hunting into a business! Go back to where you came from!!!!!

    • Tom

      I agree. These deer aren't "natural". They are raised and people pay to hunt them. It's sad that North American Whitetail would even call this a "trophy" deer. They should only cover truly free ranging deer. Not pay to hunt raised deer.

    • billy (wv hunter)

      You have the fortune to live in an area that has food/genetics/managment that can produce a big deer. When you start bashing out of stater, what would you do if you had hunted for 20 yrs and never saw a deer over 130 other than out of state. People who has a passion for hunting go out and HUNT for places that they can have a CHANCE at a trophy class deer. I am an average joe, but have a passion for unlike many. I agree with high fences…no records etc…., but outfitters are just like you if you manage your property, dont shoot little bucks, cull bucks you believe decreases genes/health of your herd, and feed the deer to ensure amble growth and health especially during the growth of anlters/fawns and in the winter months. Because they put all the time and effort into it, they charge money that many of us can not afford, but others will pay. I know many do not like outfitters because they can pay high prices for land and keep us, average joes out of areas where we would love to hunt, but we should not bash them for working, doing something they love, and feeding their families. "Ransom", im sure if you love hunting, and never seen anything bigger than a 100in 8pt where U lived, you would not be knocking out of staters and you would be carpooling with us to public land that gives you a chance to fulfill a dream!!!

    • billybobahole

      So your 200 incher. Must be listed in B&C. And if you've killed several giant whitetails. Then why should it bother you at all? Why should only residents be allowed to hunt if giant bucks are everywhere? And if you don't like nonresident hunters. And your whole town hates outfitters. And everyone across your state hates outfitters and nonresident hunters. Push your legislators to get rid of it all?? And then you can watch farms go under. Your precious resource go down the crapper!! And then your deer herds will head to what few food sources you have left. Become stunted like too many bass in a pond. For one I'm sure just about any properties in your state are benefitting from management practices by these outfitters. Two ,the revenues brought to your small towns will go poof! Three, there will be fewer hunters to move these reclusive animals out of their sanctuaries to other hunters. To me your a greedy and jealous individual. And if all hunters were like you in every state. No need for new hunting product development. No need for people to dump money in another state. Hell might as well reduce gun inventories or the sale of firearms in each state at the local gunshops.. if we all decided to do away with nonresident hunting imagine what the economy would be like come hunting season? Or no outfitters were allowed. I bet hunting season would be magnificent. Don't worry my brother sportsman. Got no ambition to come and step on your secluded soil. Hunters unite!! But not in Illinois. Apparently its not the united states anymore!!?? You can have Obama back very soon.

  • mike

    Why all the bashing guys?
    We are all hunters,if thats not the way YOU choose to hunt then thats fine,but dont throw mud,at someone that does!!
    Bottom line is i'm 100% sure NAW is not going to profile a buck taken any other way than fair chase and by legal means.
    Goodness gracious,like a bunch of 5th graders…..

  • mike

    If you dont know for a fact these guys have a high fence ranch,why on earth would you just throw something like that out there,with nothing to back it up?

    Seems the owner,and some of his clients, have stated that is NOT the case.

    • Ben

      I don't think the real argument here is if it was high fenced or not. The fact is there is a real advantage there and the hunting conditions aren't natural. To call this deer a true trophy is an over statement. It is a very nice deer but very little skill was needed to harvest this animal. These ranches are taking away from the sport of whitetail hunting and diminishing the significance of a true trophy taken in the wild under natural conditions. With that being said, I guess a trophy is in the eyes of the beholder. If a person can be proud of taking a deer on a place such as this, so be it. I am just surprised that North American Whitetail would call it a trophy.

  • Bill

    I killed one of my cows in the "wild" too. I shook the grain bucket and he came in and I shot him. No fences either!!!

    • applepickers

      Do you know what a cow is?

  • Heidi

    Unbelievable that u people obviously have nothing better to do then run your mouths about something u know nothing about! It takes a real man to run your mouth Pat & Ransom to say oh i live in the area I know how they run there business! Seriously your grown ass men & u have to make stuff up when if you really lived in the area u know damn well these deer arent fenced in! Pathetic that grown men make things up & lie out of pure jealousy & envy! I mean anybody can go see themselves the property of River 2 River which i wish people would because it would prove what assholes & how pathetic u 2 are & that includes Eric, Josh & John! I have personally seen the property they hunt, know the owners & how much time & hard work they put in to run a successful outfitting business! RANSOM LOL you mention how disliked they are, I have never heard 1 negative comment & know tons of people that come back year after year for several years to hunt with them! Does that tell u something it should! Call there references! Its all pathetic especially grown ass men lying & making things up for what? What are you gaining? Nothing!!! Seriously Grow Up! Its not Outfitters ruining hunting it assholes like u that run your mouth when u know nothing!

    • Bill

      They come back because they are lazy rich aholes that don't want to work for a trophy. Fenced in or not, it is not a natural hunting environment…PERIOD!!!!!! As far as Ransom saying that ranches are disliked, most true hunters would say the same. You wouldn't know that though because I doubt you know what real hunting is. I would take it you are involved with the operation in some way or at least friend with them. Nobody is making stuff up about these ranches. They ruining hunting and turning whitetail hunting into a business for greed. It is a fact. If your ranch isn't fenced, so what. It still creates an unnatural hunting environment. These deer aren't trophies by any stretch of the imagination. If you were an actual hunter HEIDI, you would know this. So maybe you should keep your mouth shut and keep preparing the meals for the "TROPHY" hunters.

      • applepickers

        Heide, pay no attension to bill probably never hunted or killed a deer in his life.

    • michael

      GOOD ONE BUDDY!!! i hate ass holes like that too, they they bitch like lil girls or old women the cant kill the the deer or they kill all the babys so there r no big deer but they will bitch about the next man. No matter what someone does to help the will all was bitch. I fine that the ones site and run there mouth they dont hunt,sit in the woods for mabey an hour or two. I know some people that go out west with outfitters too ABOUT STUFF U KNOW NOTHING ABOUT. Go kill ur night deer women. ASS HOLES

      • Knowsall

        Kill, kill, kill. You sound very intelligent.

  • Bill

    Hummmm…….I would say Heidi is Adam because the DA still says "there" instead of "their". Maybe he should quit shooting tame deer and go back to school.

    • Heidi

      Is that really all you can come up with?? Seriously? Cant come up with anything honest to post but you can leave a lame post like that! Maybe you should go back to school to get a real job so you can shoot a real deer and so you wouldnt have to waste your time posting lame comments! If anyone is a dumbass its you! LAME!

  • JMONEY

    Congrats on a great buck. Do not let people tarnish your moment and keep going on outfitted hunts. I am from Northern Va as well and I know why you travel to the mid west to hunt. Outfitted hunts and high fence hunts are two different things and it is sad that some people don't know the difference. I happen to be good friends with one of the top outfitters in Ohio and you are hunting 100% wild deer and you will not find anyone that works as hard as he does to give you a great experience. I actually killed a 200" plus deer and declined to do an article because of the way people assume and write things they know nothing about. I do it because I love bow hunting and for NO other reason. Congrats to River 2 River outfitters for working hard for your clients and don't pay attention to comments that come from ignorant people who are clueless! Stay strong in the Lord! Mathew 7:1

    • Bryan

      If you killed your 200" deer on a paid ranch, it should not be in any record book. You did not do the work needed to harvest the buck. That's the point most are making I think. It is a very fine buck and I'm sure he is proud of it. There is land to hunt that isn't a ranch if people take the time to find it but most want a sure thing. I guess it's just differences in hunting preferences. I'm sorry but no congrats here to any ranch from me. They have their place I guess but not when it comes to bragging about killing trophy whitetail.

  • JMONEY

    You are right if it is a ranch that is high fenced but most outfitters are leasing farms that are working farms and just leasing the rights to hunt it. Outfitters are paying high dollars to lease family farms and managing buck to doe ratio as well as letting the bucks reach maturity before harvesting them. They are still wild and most state prohibit baiting so you are hunting soy beans and corn fields. Just because you are not doing the scouting you still have to put your time in on stand and most times you don't get a shot at a 140'. I have sat dark to dark on many hunts for days without 1 shot and I understand that fair chase whitetail hunting has no slam dunks like high fence hunts. I run trail cameras all year and put countless hours scouting and hanging stands all year in Va but I still enjoy going to other states to hunt. Good outfitters do the same and I don't feel like it is a sure thing.

    • Bryan

      Agreed. I just hope it doesn't become too commercialized.

  • Adam

    Well i took a few days and went back to school like Bill suggested and i still didn't learn shit!!! I got my degree somehow because i was to busy getting hot ass puss and partying while all you spell checkers were in your dorms spanking your monkey dreaming of the girls i was with!!! So correct away because i don't give a shit and since your so smart you can decode all my misspellingings F
    UCK
    OFFFFFFF !!!! Get that!!!!?????.,;,fmniwnmwijben.. I LOVE RIVER 2 RIVER its where all the deer are tied to a tree and eat apples out of your hands, some of you jealous F— should go there,their, they're (BOB) And tyr to mate with them so you can smarting these big bucks up so they don't just lay under the stands and wait for you to kill them!!!!!!!!

    • Steve

      Finally an honest post by Adam and River 2 River. Thanks guys.

    • JMONEY

      People who have never been on an outfitted hunt have NO idea what it really takes to put clients on deer. They work very hard doing things by the book and putting a lot of hard work into hopefully getting you a chance at a shot. Bottom line is that you still have to get to full draw and make the shot, not easy in some cases and then put 200" of bone on the head and things become a lot more difficult! I know you are mad and I feel your frustration but you have to understand that some people just don't know the facts. Keep hunting hard and don't let others tarnish your moment.

  • Bryan

    That's the point JMONEY. They put the hunter on the deer. The hunter doesn't put himself on the deer. It may be done by the "book" but they go to these places because their chances are far far greater. They killed 4 booners that week??? Come on. Is that their argument. This is clearly strong evidence what people have been saying on here. The facts are that it is much easier to harvest a trophy whitetail on one of these ranches. If you can't agree to that, then you don't know the facts. If he is proud to kill this buck on a ranch, so be it. But to have North American Whitetail call it a trophy????? Shame.

    • JMONEY

      Bryan most bucks in NAW are killed on private farms leased by outfitters. These are the same kind of farms that average people are hunting except they are managed to let reach maturity. I do agree that your chances are greater when you hunt these properties and that's why people go their. I think everyone has a different opinion on the subject and I see both sides on the subject and I feel that it is no different than me planting food plots on land that I lease here in Va and passing 130"s so they can reach their full potential and then inviting you to hunt with me and you kill a 170". Trophy or not?

  • Bryan

    I see what you are saying but I think the comparison you make is a little different than River 2 River….but I get your point. I personally don't like to see what's going on with certain ranches though. I guess not all are bad though. It comes to a fine line and a difference in opinion I guess. If a person goes to hunt a ranch, scouts, and sets his own stands, he would have a greater sense of pride in taking trophy whitetail. It is a very touchy subject though. To answer your question…if you "invite" me to hunt and I do the work, I think it would be a trophy. I think bad things come around when people and money mix………..good point you make.

    • JMONEY

      Bryan I am not defending River 2 River because I have never been their but I have hunted Hadley Creek a couple of times along with Hunt Masters Lodge a few times as well and I can asure you it is HARD hunting with NO assurance to even see a 140" and up. I wish I had more time to travel to other states and scout before I hunted their but between setting myself up in my home state, working and raising a family it is very hard so I do pay to hunt other states. My 200" was taken in Ohio on a family owned farm and I was in the right place at the right time, less then a week later I shot a 165" buck that we have been passing for the last 2 years and I have numerous trail cam pictures of. The 165" meant a lot more to me than the 200" so I do see your point as well. Joel Snow is the owner of Hunt Masters Lodge and he has become a good friend and I can tell you he works harder than anyone I know I have ever met to try and assure people that they will have a great experience and you know that anytime a 200" can step into your shooting lane. I actually have enjoyed our discussion and I wish you the best of luck. God bless you my brother.

      • Bryan

        Ohio huh. That's where I hunt. Southeast Ohio. I have taken 11 bucks over 140" ranging from 143" to 202 3/8" and other Pope & Young bucks. All of these deer were taken on about 1000 acres over 20 years. I would like to see a picture of your deer if possible. You can send it to Anderson.eric429@yahoo.com if you don't mind. I enjoy seeing these deer. I can send you pics of mine if you would like. Thanks for your insight on this topic. God Bless

        • JMONEY

          Wow Bryan sounds like you have been blessed by our Lord! I will send you some pictures and would love to see yours as well. Hopefully in a few years I will be able to buy some land in S.E. Ohio and enjoy more than 6 days a year their. I will shoot you a email in a little while. God bless

  • Randy

    You guys bashing this deer and keep saying it's on a ranch need to do some research,I think you should say it's on land you can't hunt so you are jealous.It's not a high fence operation,it's managed private ground owned or leased by the outfitter.There are high fence operations in Texas also but some contain thousands of acres that are high fenced to keep poachers and predators out.Get off his case,it's a great deer and NAW wouldn't have it here if it was on a canned hunt.Congrats

    • Eric

      NAW would and did cover it because they are in business to make money too. It's how they sell their product. Just as River 2 River and other ranches. No true hunter is jealous of a ranch killed buck. A true hunter wants a challenge not a guarantee. No congrats.

  • J. Kontras

    Although these "ranches" might be "fair chase" in many people's opinion, there is nothing natural about seeing several 200 inch whitetail deer on any farm. Anyone who is not "idiotic" and is truly a dedicated bow hunter knows that seeing a 200 inch whitetail in the wild is very very rare. To kill a deer of this magnitude is even more rare. These ranches where people buy hunts often feed the deer with many different food sources including food plots, livestock food bins, electronic feeders, and other devices.The amount of antler growing products on the market has gotten ridiculous. I agree with all those guys out there that do it the challenging way and do not buy into these products. Try growing a pair and hunt a deer that has not been manufactured by some antler growth product. Guys like Cameron Hanes are great examples. That guy knows what it takes and does it the hard way. It takes hard work and when it comes to killing a booner or bigger in the wild, nothing will be handed to anyone. The above deer is a great trophy, but would be much better if it was not killed on a ranch where you pay to kill a big deer. All anyone cares about anymore is killing a big deer so they can brag to their buddies! In reality, there are not that many guys out there that kill 200 inch deer in a completely fair chase atmosphere. Its like the 196 typical that was killed in Ohio this year…. that buck was shot in a high fence area. Congratulations! The deer in these places are not hard to kill and very concentrated in one area, nor are they half as smart as "Wild deer". Everyone out there that thinks hunting a ranch or high fence area is the same as hunting truly wild deer is crazy and y'all need to do some research.

    • Merk

      J. Kontras you don' t have a clue what you are talking about! You are making yourself look like a complete idoit! These deer are not as smart as what deer? Ha Ha I can't believe what idiots you guys are! They are deer that are on private farms just like deer that everyone else hunts. Nobody said anyhthing about seein 200 inch deer everywhere! They just don't shoot little young bucks that some of you guys call a "true trophy"! You guys are just so jealous that you can't kill a mature deer that you have to bash on people that do. These guys lease land that you guys used to mooch on for free and it makes you mad! Everyone pays to hunt, if you hunt public land our taxes pay for it! If you lease land you are doing the samething outfitters do you. You are paying to hunt that land! If you own land you have to pay for it unless you are a spoiled brat and it is handed down to you in that case someone paid for it! All it comes down to is you guys can only kill year and a half and two and a half year old deer and are so jealous of people who let them walk to kill mature bucks!

      • Eric

        Let's take a poll of hunters and see what they think. Any true hunter knows the answer. It isn't about jealousy at all. It's about the ranches diminishing the integrity of the sport. It says on their site that they have seen more 200" bucks. This is not typical anywhere in a natural environment. If you were a true hunter, you would know that. You would also know that killing four booners in one week is highly unnatural. Even on 4000 acres…..COME ON! Any true hunter knows who the idiot is here. And if you want to compare trophy rooms, come down to SE Ohio. All of my deer were killed under natural circumstances on my own……not on a ranch. JUST SAYIN…………

    • HoytElement

      you need to do some research…..this was yes an outfitter but not a "high fence" ranch….quit being such a hater just because you don't have the money for an outfitter (which by the way is no guarantee of killing a monster)

  • Eric

    Well said J. Kontras!

    • J. Kontras

      Thanks man.

  • Russ

    Hey Heidi,
    Apparently you don't comprehend what you read. Before you went on that big rant on Ransom, Eric and others, you should have re-read his post. He said there are three outfitters where he lives in southern Illinois and the locals don't like/hate them. He didn't say River2River was one of the outfitters. Ransom has been getting in deer stands since he was 5 years old and has killed several big deer, including one well over 200 inches. I know this because I'm his father. What our point is about all this fussing is; We and a whole lot of other hunters feel like hunting is no longer a sport. It has become "BIG BUSINESS". Russ

  • Russ

    They "grow big deer " for people to show up with their checkbook and sit where the outfitters tell you and papow!! You're a big- time hunter. I've been hunting for many years and have some wall hangers myself (none 200 inches) so I know what it takes to kill a trophy whitetail. I equate what deer ranches/outfitters are doing (to make a buck) to professional athletes taking steroids. It's messing with Mother Nature. Hence, "THEY" have ruined DEER HUNTING!! Heidi, I hope your father is as proud of you as I am of Ransom. I can tell by your post that you are a classy gal. Russ

  • Heidi

    Thanks for clearing that up. Aww thats great u make dad proud! My dad has been hunting his whole life too & with outfitters for the last 10 years! You might actually have seen him on tv & in magazines so when he gets back from his hunt in Illinois next week ill get him on here to to tell u how proud he is! Hes more of a man then any of u & just because he has money to pay to hunt, dont hate!! He definitely has some wall hangers, actually a full room of them & all kinds of other animals that u have to pay to kill! He loves hunting more than anything but if u dont have land to hunt or its not given to u & u love the sport people pay to do it! Just because an outfitter takes u to a stand, the hunter still pulls the trigger! They're just hunting on someone else's land! Its not like theyre calling the deer in to u! You people are all against outfitters, I hate to break it to u they're all over the world so post and bash away, its something thats never going away! Im done wasting my time, these posts are going nowhere! I have to go cook for my "trophy hunters" now & Russ I have more class then u could ever imagine & Ransom what kind of name is that? Seriously lol! Have a wonderful day!

    • treedemon

      well said heidi, there are wild deer all over that actually make it to be over 200"
      they got that way because the outfitters/landowners actually let them reach maturity buy not shooting them
      GO FIGURE!!! its all of the haters and their neighbors who keep shooting the immature deer and wonder why they dont have anything worth a crap on their properties, some people have money and can travel to other states and get a tag and go hunting, you are lucky to be able to hunt with your dad, keep up the great work and dont let the haters get you too upset

  • Russ

    Heidi-n-Seeky,
    I would explain where the name originates from, but, I'm sure you wouldn't comprehend it. You're right about one thing though, I can' t imagine how much class you have. I'm sure it's right up there with the rest of Jerry Springer's guests!!

    • Heidi

      Good one Russy is that all you can come up with really? lol! Im laughing so hard it hurts! Probably just like your mom, is that how you know about Jerry Springer? That comment was about as stupid as it gets so I thought I would throw one in thats to your level! How old are you? Really? You wouldnt know class if it came knocking on your front door! Im done wasting my time and to be truthful your not worth wasting my time on but you definitely gave me some good laughs! Heidi-n-Seeky really lol? Im not the one hiding anything, how about Ransom??? Enjoy your day I have better things to do!

  • Luke

    The bottom line here is that ANYONE who defends killing a high fenced deer or sitting in an outfitter's treestand and killing a trophy buck has NEVER done it the hard way, or can't get it done the hard way. As far as ruining hunting, this is absolutely correct in every fashion. Hunting a high fence or a managed outfitter's property is "paying to kill", not "hunting". Nobody will ever respect how this buck was killed and it could never be compared to bucks of the 200" mark killed the real way. I know a lot of guys with money who would never dream of bragging about or even posting a picture of a buck killed in this fashion because they know its a joke. Most hunters, even in the land of the giants (Midwest United States) will hunt for a lifetime and never even see a buck that GROSS scores over 200". When you go to an outfitter or high fenced area and pass up a 180" typical with your bow, you can bet it is an absolute joke of a hunt. This "opinion" has nothing to do with jealousy. It is just a fact. Will Pope and Young or Boone and Crockett even accept an entry of this buck? I doubt it. My dad killed the Ohio State Record typical whitetail in 1986 with a recurve. It scored 201 1/8. Every single year since, there was supposedly a buck that eclipsed this state record killed, but somehow, it never shows up in the record books, and the state record still stands. People do not realize the magnitude or rarity of a fair chase whitetail of this size. It just does not happen that easy. Everyone should take a lesson from guys like Gene and Barry Wensel, who you can bet want to laugh and vomit at the same time when pictures and stories like this are posted. This is not hunting.

    • Hotnuts

      Luke, your dads deer is bullshit to, i heard that it was killed in a cage at the local fair. No congrats on your dads record deer.
      See how easy it is to post something you know nothing about?

  • Luke

    I honestly cannot even believe that North American Whitetail published this story. This stuff makes me sick. As an avid bowhunter, I don't believe for a second that I stand alone when I say that with all honesty I am MUCH more impressed with 125" typical killed under true fair chase conditions than I ever will be with this "manufactured" whitetail. A whitetail of this magnitude requires an extreme amount of skill, knowledge, and a tactical game plan formulated over years of scouting to be harvested. A 6 year old girl could have just as easily sat in the stand when the outfitter says "sit in this stand here" and killed this buck. Guys that do this stuff ruin it for everyone. I'm sure this guy is just the average lazy hunter who has no concept of real hunting. On the other hand, now he can brag to his buddies that used to stuff him in the locker in high school.

    • Hotnuts

      Dipshit!!!

  • Hoss88

    it really doesnt matter wether it was killed in the wild or on a farm the guy sat in a stand or blind and he had t call the deer in it says right under the picture he sat and waited for the deer to come in i would rather see someone kill one from a stand then from a truck going down the road

    • Bryan

      Must be a non-hunter.

  • Russ

    Luke,
    You said it BROTHER!! We couldn't agree more with everything you had to say! TRUE DEER HUNTERS (not shootists) know the difference. These people that pay to get in a stand on these ranches and then have the nerve to want recognition for a deer that has been raised, fed "STEROIDS FOR DEER" are posers!! Well said Luke.
    Russ

  • bucdoc 160

    there are two typesof people ,one who hunts and one who opens his wallet and pay someon to find a place,put up a stand, bait the area,monitor the times when the bucks move through,hold their hand and wipe their ass so they can shoot a big deer. i'd rather shoot doe's knowing i did it myself… what are you going to do when the market fails and there is anarchey,confusion,and uncertanty,store shelves are empty and there is mass histeria? i'll grab my gun head for the woods and do what i know best …HUNT.

  • Dennis

    All I can is WOW!! After reading NAW for 25+ yrs., I saw many stories about jealousy and hatred directed toward someone who was lucky enough to harvest a world class deer, but never dreamed it was this malicious. FACT is this deer was shot under air chase conditions (No fence) and the only bad thing about it is that's its not mine. So far all you haters out there, get over it. I have been on numerous guided hunts all over the country for one reason and one reason ONLY. That is the only way to get access to areas that have these type of deer. I'm from SC and we have 2 deer in the B&C book, so all you expert hunters come on down and show me how it's done. I'll get you free access to thousands of acres.

    • Eric

      I think you have it wrong. It isn't hate and jealousy towards that hunter. If that's the way he wants to hunt and he can be proud of it, more power to him. It wasn't luck or skill on his side. It was the work of the ranch. Don't you get it. The deer population and quality there is being taken to an unnatural state. Not only there but all over the country. This is the point that o's being made…..at least by me. Hunting is becoming way too commercialized in my opinion. You are dead wrong about saying this is the only way to gain access to this caliber of deer. In my region, there are thousands of acres of public hunting land. Any out of state hunter can purchase a license. I hunt next to these public areas and can tell you that there are very big bucks there. (Ohio). The reason you and others go to ranches is because it's easier(in most cases)and you want a "sure" thing. So don't cop out and say it's jealousy. There may be some that are but most avid bow hunters just see their sport being tarnished. It is a very very fine buck. Would he have killed it if not for the work of the ranch and the unnatural conditions…….. You answer that.

      • Dennis

        Thank you for the enlightenment , you're 100% right!!!!. someone managing their land by providing proper nutrition, controlling population and having a more balanced age/sex ratio is "unnatural" especially WITHOUT a f….ing fence in sight. All the QDMA is all a bunch of crap.

        Us dumbass rednecks down south have an expression that is quite appropriate here. "you can't fix stupid".
        Case closed

        • Eric

          You obviously didn't read my entire post or care to understand what point I am trying to make. I'm sure by your post that you are a ranch hunter also….which is fine. If you want a true fair chase challenge, I can show you plenty of public hunting land. I'm sure you won't though because like most of these ranch hunters, you are probably all about the "so called" trophy. Congrats.

    • Snowman

      Well said Dennis…..good luck to you. Congrats Mr. Schultz!!! Awesome deer! I'm booking a hunt with River to River next year to have a chance at bucks like this in a fair chase environment.

      Not sure why the bashers are so jealous……

      One last thing for Adam………I've been lmfao since your last post! Please post pics of college girlfriends and keep posting comments. Love it when jealous bashers get put in their place!!!!!

      Good luck to all!

      • Eric

        Whatever you are proud of. Any true hunter knows what it truly takes to harvest a mature buck. If you are satisfied going to a ranch for a week and letting them place you on a buck, more power to you. Is this "fair" chase?? I think not …..along with a lot of other avid bow hunters. No true bow hunter is jealous of a ranch deer or any other deer killed by a fellow hunter. It is what the farms and ranches are doing to the sport of bow hunting. Don't be lazy. Hunt public land. There is plenty to hunt.

    • nc/wv bowhunter

      I agree with you. A few guys from ILL can call people back hunters etc….because we look for places that have genetics to produce a good deer. I live in NC now, and a few areas have harvest a nice record deer from time to time, but they are few and far between. . . rather in ILL if every local hunter does not kill a 140plus they had a really bad yr. . . its not they same. Killing a mature buck here may be equal to ILL hunters killing a b/c buck because with same age, many will score b/c there. I hate hunters getting jealous, and understand its getting harder to find the high end land, but locals should bash everyone for tring to get a chance at something they were born in the middle of.

  • David Tomter

    You have to hunt were 200 class bucks live.95% of hunters dont.People that have the 2000 acres can manage bucks without disruption.Also need neighbor cooperation.QDM.If you hunt for 30 years and keep shooting 140 class bucks you obviously want to shoot bigger bucks.If you dont have them you have to pay someone that does.That doesnt mean they have high fence.It means they have good bucks.This is typical bowhunter jelousy.The guys critical cant keep the bow steady from shaking in there pants.Congratulations on an excellent kill.

    • Eric

      Again with the jealousy. Get real. You can manage 2000 acres without disruption??? Obviously you don't know much about deer movement. You should research and rethink that statement. If you keep shooting 140 bucks, no wonder you have to go somewhere else. This subject is about keeping some kind of integrity to bowhunting and sense of pride in the sport. I don't believe the "typical" bowhunter is jealous of anothers kill. I think he embraces him with a sence of pride. There are some who may be jealous. I think they are the ones who don't know the true reason for hunting.

  • bucdoc 160

    the problem is 95% of ill. land is privately owned, we as residents do all we can to aquire and keep the rights to the property we HUNT on, such as befriending the land owner, offering free labor, being at their beck and call doing some of the hardest and shittiest work out there just to ensure that we have a place to hang a stand in the fall… enter the out-of-state stuffed shirt, waving cash around and making offers a farmer can't refuse. please don't call yourself a hunter, it takes more than money to earn that title, so i'll just call u DICK

    • bucdoc 160

      are you one? or do you know how to HUNT? it's one or the other…

      • booner

        Yes, I'm a rich dick who leases over 3000 acres in pike county Missouri with 3 other rich dicks. None of us know how to hunt on our own, but we have all somehow gotten lucky enough to harvest a mature buck the last 5 years in a row(each one of us) Smallest 144, largest 182. average high 150. But again, with your reasoning, since were rich dicks, we don't know how to hunt.

        • bucdoc 160

          yep!!!

          • nc/wv bowhunter

            Obviously you may not know how to hunt either. If you are such a great hunter, go to a state not known as the best in the work bucdoc and pull out a few wall hangers. Anyone can sit in ILL and say they know how to hunt because they have killed big deer, but the area is known for it, and your neighbors are probably letting the deer walk that you shoot, so you shouldnt be bashing others. Because they have money, they may be a great hunter, but the areas they live dont produce the deer that the mid west does. I harvested 9 deer with bow this yr in 3 states, one being 130in 8pt (my second biggest buck) and all were on land I scouted, hung stands, and played wind myself, however, I have never seen a p/y buck in nc where I live, and not many locals have either. So, it does not mean the person is not a good hunter, because they was not born in a state with giant deer like you. Go south and kill a few deep woods/mt deer and then call yourself a good hunter!

          • Eric

            Nice job boner!!!! But I dont believe your story. I agree with NC/wv bowhunter. You wouldn't make somewhere where it was a challenge.

          • bucdoc 160

            i live here, thats what we are talking about, out-of-staters coming here. now you want me to be an out-of-stater just for a chance to shoot a turd deer.thanks but i'll stay here and hunt big deer and out of state p/u's near my spot.

          • Eric

            Lol. See your point.

        • treedemon

          works pretty good doesnt it?, rich or not these people who critisize you are just limited to what they can do. you guys are doing a good job of managing your lease and thats what it takes,most farmers dont hunt, and they like money,im always looking for more great land to lease, but its already leased and there is a long list of people who want it ahead of me,there are allot of assholes out here who just like to bash because they didnt think ahead and get a good education and job and wonder now why the walmart job they have isnt getting them anything in life except a few minutes of time on the computer at work on their break, oh yeah i misspelled a few words, thats too bad isnt it?

          • Knowsall

            U r a true DA.

          • bucdoc160

            so you know how it feels when a farmer tells you, No, someone with more money got here before you. maybe you should shut your cocksucker and get the fuck off the property because some asshole was way ahead of YOU.

          • Knowsall

            That was to treedemon not bucdoc160.

  • bucdoc 160

    if you can't do better than a 150 average, why are you in pike county ill. why don't you spend you money on big bucks? like whats on my fathers property in north alberta canada, where bucks like yours are laughed at .

    • booner

      Hey genius! Learn how to read

      • bucdoc 160

        whaaaaaaaaat?

        • Booner

          Yea genius learn to fucking read!!!!. I said pike county Missouri, not IL and an average of high 150's means like 158. If u and your asshole friends can AVERAGE that or 5 years more power to you. In the meantime shut the hell up. I'm tired of listening to your stupidity. Don't bother to respond, this is me ignoring you!

          • Eric

            Probably shot them with a rifle you boner. What a DA.

          • bucdoc 160

            wow! you are a dick

  • RANSOM

    Well for all of you Pro outfitters and out of staters, I am just loving it that this is finally coming to a head and people are getting a real idea of how we feel about you kind of people. Haters is not the word I would use, disgusted is a better term. So take your rich self back to where you came from and none of this would have to happen. It is too bad the "good ole boy" days have became a thing of the past. But maybe conversations like this will make you (outfitters and out of staters) realize that you are not liked or wanted by and of the local hunters in the area in which you are going to hunt. So congrats on shooting a deer, not hunting it you city slicker.

    • bucdoc 160

      well said ransom but i think i still have some good ole boy left in me and it just might come out if i find one of these clowns lurking around my hunting spot

      • bucdoc 160

        shut-up stupid

  • Russ

    I genuinely feel for the guy/gal that lives in a state that doesn't have good deer hunting ground. In a perfect world I would like to see these out-of-staters come here and beat the bushes. Like bucdoc said, befriend the landowner, put in a little work, give them some venison, etc… But that perfect world has been gone for a long time. Outfitters bought/leased the ground for big bucks and the local boy that has hunted these propeties for generations is just SOL! It used to be that the farmer was happy to have help taking out the deer to help with crop damage until the big carrot was dangled. If the shoe was on the other foot, I bet some of you big mouthed assholes would see the locals side in a different light

  • Jeff

    This is like a good movie i just couldnt stop reading all your ridiculous post.So if i got this all right i'm not suppose to manage my land,i'm not suppose to put salt licks or mineral licks out, i'm not suppose to put food plots in,and if one of my buddies wants to go hunting with me he can definately not hunt a stand i have pre hung or other wise if he shoots a big buck he gets no credit.seriously go back and read what you all have wrote.Randy congratulations on your awesome buck!!! i have friends that come from north carolina to hunt with me. i hope they don't kill a big deer while they are on my farms in missouri it would be a shame for them to not get credit.I do find it amusing that your glad this all finally came to a head there were like 10 guys that are being stupid.Let me tell you thats alot 10 out of how many hunters in illinois stop being an idiot.

    • Eric

      It was a little different sinario than you described. He paid to shoot. They did all the work. So don't be a DA. MOST avid bow hunters agree that this is a very fine buck…..but not a trophy. So don't kid yourself. It isn't just hunters in Illinois. It is nation wide. The point is that hunting is becoming too commercialized. It may not affect you and me now but what about generations to come? That is what I'm worried about. The ranches are worried about making their money. I see your point about letting your friend hunt. Did the friend pay? Did he scout? It is a fine line I guess. I don't know what the answer is. I just don't think that making money and hunting mix. There is plenty of public hunting land where I live and it is not crowded. That is if you want a challenge instead of a sure thing. Good point Jeff.

      • Dennis

        You know Eric, you have not said ONE positive comment to anyone about anything on this site since this story first aired, first it's a ranch, it's fenced, he paid to shoot it, ts unnatural, etc.. Get over yourself Mr. High and mighty. I wonder what your comments would be if your hunting area was not within a short drive from your house( u said u live in OH, so I assume I'm right).

        I don't think your comments would be the same if you had a 20+ hr drive to your hunting area – like I would if I wanted to be a " real hunter" in your eyes and come hunt public land up there. A mature buck here in SC both public and private would score about 120

        Food for thought

        • Eric

          I did say it was a fine buck. I didn't say anything about a high fence….unless someone used Eric. I see your point though. I truly believe these ranches are hurting the integrity of whitetail hunting. They raise the deer and set their clients where the deer come out based on their year long scouting. Nothing to do with actual hunting by the hunter. What happens generations down the road when ranch and rich hunters lease the land and drive the average Joe hunter out. It happens everyday.

          I have went out of state to Utah and Canada. I killed animals in both places on public hunting land. If you come to Ohio and hunt the Wayne national forest, you will have an excellent chance at a big buck. Possibly a 200+. So there are places out there for those who don't have the money.

          I'm sorry if I offended you or anyone else about the true hunter comment. I just meant someone who likes to set their own stand, do their own scouting, and do their own work. I didn't mean to diminish anyones hunting skills. You are right. My comments may be different if I had to drive far all the time. I don't know. Good point. Thanks for your comments. Please think about our future generations and where they will hunt. I am truly not a high and mighty person. I'm just passionate about this sport.

    • JMONEY

      Well said my friend!!!!!!!!!!

  • bphilb

    I am truly amazed at all the negative comments here. Particularly when you watch outdoor television and most of the shows are shot on outfitted hunts. No where in this article has there been mention of high fence operation here. Although I watched Dave Watson shoot a remarkable 10-pointer this week on Mathew's' show at Mustang Creek Ranch…a high fence operation in Texas. Are you guys screaming about that???
    River 2 River is not a high fence operation. they apparently lease a bunch of farms in Southern Illinois at the current market price. Most of those farms are just that…farms. Hmm, just like the Drurys and the Lakoskys. If watch those shows carefully the Drurys and the Lakoskys are not always hunting their personal farms. As a matter of fact Lee has killed some huge Mule Deer on the show and, oh my gosh, he is hunting with an outfitter. What about Waddell or Raglin? They don't even own any hunting property. They always hunt with an outfitter or a friends farm.

    • treedemon

      actually michael owns a big place in ks

    • bob

      AMEN!!!!

      Thanks YOU!!

  • bphilb

    The Lakoskys put out the cameras and do the hard work then they film Jimmy Little from Buckmasters shooting a monster 9-pointer on the first night of his hunt. Did Mr. Little do the legwork…No. He got in a stand that he was told to get in and hunted a cut bean field and shot a huge IA buck. What is the difference. Oh, that's right! He did not pay.
    If you go to the River2River website you will see that you are penalized $500 for shooting a lesser buck. they are trophy managing the property. That means building a natural inventory of mature bucks, Isn't that what we all preach when it comes to growing giant whitetails? Let the younger bucks walk, provide high quality food sources and shoot an adequate number of does.
    What I read in many of these comments is envy. Randy has the means, did the research and found an outfitter that met his requirements. Congrats to Randy for a great whitetail deer. I am sorry that there are so many high and mighty folks who opt to comment before thinking.

  • TC HUNTER

    It is interesting to note that hunters who have the financial means can book a hunt in Alaska for bear or sheep with a registered guide as required by law, shoot a great trophy (with a little bit of luck) and this is perfectly acceptable. By contrast if you book a hunt with a reputable whitetail guide a lot of folks consider it cheating. Would it be acceptable if that hunter had to book a hunt with a reputable guide or outfitter if it were require by law in order to even hunt in the state as a non resident? Is B&C going to mark this trophy with an STAR saying that it was shot on a guided hunt? I THINK NOT. TC HUNTER

  • Russ

    There are milions of people that feel the same way we do Jeff (you idiot). They just aren't on this site or choose to remain silent mainly for fear of repercussion. It's easier. Also, I don't have any respect for what Waddell, the Drurys, The Lakoskys or any of the PROS do. It's my opinion that they are getting rich from their tv shows from idiots like you that watch them. Wake up sucker, you're feeding them. It's plain and very simple… ya'll have turned a great sport for ALL into BIG BUSINESS FOR THE ELITE…YOU IDIOT! One day you will wake up and find you have to PAY TO HUNT ANYWHERE… How smart will you all be then?

  • bucdoc 160

    i hunt on a property that is 4000 acres it is shaped like tiangle,it's an old platation that has high fences,there is one opening about 20 ft wide on the south point, that is where i put my stand, at the other end somehow 27 coon and fox hounds got loose in there.then a 209 4/8" buck came through my opening and i put one right in the pumpstation. congradulate me, i am an awsome hunter!!!

    • treedemon

      just like when mom yells "dinners ready" at you, downstairs, you beat your coondog to the table

      • bob

        dick

  • Travis

    To all you haters on here! Don't be jealous of our monster bucks in the IL!!! Not only did this guy kill his 200 incher but there has been 4 more over 200 killed this season in the area as well….I guess they were all fenced in though! We don't shot little deer and we like our land! I konw the river to river guys and they do a fine job!

  • slim

    i agree 100% with hunting outfitters

  • slim

    and if yall wana go crazy and say these bucks are kept in by high fences yall are crazy iv been by some of these outfitters and their land is wide open just like others and these outfitters make a living off raising big mature bucks and make money off of em to feed their familys and we feed our deer and bucks just like they do so stop saying all this bashing crap about these outfitters!!!!!!!!!!!

  • treedemon

    ok, most of the KIDS who post on here either dont have enough land to properly manage deer to reach their full potential, or dont realize that it is actually possible to let totally wild deer reach maturity. most hunters shoot immature deer because thats all they see,most deer that actually reach 5 yrs of age is probably less than 5%, thats in all of north america. Outfitters choose to lease/buy land and manage deer,they mostly do it for a living and love doing it.most of us cant do that because the prime land with nice deer on it goes to the highest bidder, sure i'm jelous but not a basher of those that are able to do this and raise totally wild deer to reach their full potential.
    so if the haters dont like it then go back to school and get a better education/job and then you can buy/lease great land, and be able to afford to go hunting with outfitters in other states who actually work their asses off to be able to offer you a shot at a truly wild managed mature deer, this is america and its legal to offer farmers money to lease their land to hunt on, some of you guys might go in together and give this a try, i know you dont want too, i didnt either but i had to just keep what i was already hunting or lose it to out of staters or locals who had the bigger pile of benjamins,remember to take care of the people you hunt on either with a nice christmas card and a few gift certificates inside, it goes a long way in retaining rights to hunt. also if i misspelled a few words then thats just too fing bad isnt it? im not an english major just a damm good bowhunter!!

  • Tom Williams

    For all of you "CRY BABY'S" out there who have NO IDEA what your talking about, Todd&Chris run a very good, straight forward fair chase operation. I live in the area and hunt on PUBLIC land much of which adjoins there areas. Great deer Randy, stand tall. TW

  • TC HUNTER

    Travis,

    You mentioned four other 200 inch deer. How many of these were green scores for a typical whitetail?

    Thanks,

    TC HUNTER

  • 047

    I'm booking a hunt with these guys ASAP. If jealous locals are talking this much smack, they must have some great deer up there. C ya at river to river very soon!!!

    • Knowsall

      Just show up. They probably have a bow you can use too…..or they can just shoot it for you. :P

  • Knowsall

    Truth hurts but sometimes you have to face it. Be proud to let someone else do the work and set you on a half tame deer. Congrats.

  • mark

    River to river is not a high fenced operation. they work hard at what they do. I live on a 300 acre cattle and hay farm with a little bit of row crop. we manage for deer also. we plant food plots and keep track of the deer all year round. Two years ago i killed a 180" ten point. river to river leases property just across the road from our farm. for the ones that said they grow deer and let them go….you are ignorant. There are monster deer running everywhere in s illinois. just take a drive in the evenings and watch bean fields. you never no what may step out next so it doesnt really matter if you are from here or come here to hunt with an outfitter or on public land, there are monster deer all over the place, you just have to be at the right place at the right time. and yes river to river does do their homework and get great farms to hunt. they do a great job and put people on deer, but they cant control the size of the deer that show up. congratulations on the huge deer.

    • Knowsall

      Yep…They PUT people on deer. People don't hunt them….good point mark. Well said.

  • Roll Tide

    I don't know how "knowsall" has time to hunt……seems to me he spends all of his time posting jealous comments on this message board.

    Nice deer Randy!

    • Knowsall

      The same as you have time I guess. It is a very nice deer. He just didn't hunt it is all.

  • Bob

    You guy are really something hiding behind the computer talking all sort of CRAP to each other. GROW UP!!

    CONGRATS ON THE BUCK MAN!

    • BOB

      Yea MAN!!!! Good JOB BOB!!!

  • kody

    wow just cuz some guy can afford to go pay a outfitter to hunt and shoots a monster people gotta bash it.Anyone of u bashing this deer would be more then pumped to be behind this deer in this pic no matter if u shot it behind your house or with an outfitter. i cant afford it and i live in ny by the PA border and i am prouder then pig shit to shoot a 120-130 class buck. This guy is lucky to hunt a spot where the deer get to grow to be giants. And if all of you are true sportsman u would be happy for the guy. congrats buddy hes a PIG

  • pageman

    that is a huge buck. biggest i've killed is a 160 class 10 at 14 years old.

  • pageman

    btw congrats im from va to.

  • logan

    god is great beer is good and peaple are crazy. awesome buck dude

  • Pallid

    You guys like Russ are just a bunch of whining sissies. Just like these goddamn Occupy Wall Street idiots. Just jealous of what everyone else has. Just crying b/c other people have success or money. Just a bunch if entitled cry baby pussies. Worried about what everyone else is doing. Who gives a rat's ass someone else kills? Buncha goddamn whiners worried about what others have. Class warfare jackasses, just like Occupy Wall Street and Obama.

  • tsmith

    Nice ranch buck,i would rather not pay thousands of dollars for a deer, it's just not hunting going into a fenced in property and guaranteeing u a deer,it's more exiting and a challenge to pick the right location for a stand and being sucessfull, but nice deer

    • tsmith

      i meant picking a location on your own property!!!

    • Billybobahole

      Then don't spend the money???

  • Gabe

    Most of the idiots making ridiculous comments on this page about "outfitters and ranches" wouldn't know a 200 inch deer if it landed in thier lap BUT what they also don't know is that thier are ALOT of HUGE deer that come off of public land in Illinois (and other MidWest States). I am from NC and have driven to Illinois for the last 10 years to hunt on public land (because I cant afford an outfitter), I know of at least 5 or 6 bucks killed that will score over 185" just on the public land that I have hunted, and lots over 140"! The fact is that deer just grow bigger out there! It's not because they raise them in a pen! If the HATERS on here hunted as hard as they MAKE UP EXCUSES and reasons why other prople kill big bucks and they don't then they would kill one! I can tell you this,……. if I could afford to hunt with an outfitter or lease my on land in the midwest I certianly would.

  • bucdoc160

    i live in south central ill, our state and d.o.c. are broke, i heard to generate more revenue for the conservation department, non-resident hunting pemits wille cost $5,000 and deer tags will cost $10,000 each. this is welcome sign of how state government should operate, supply and demand.

  • Jim K

    Nice reading all the jerk comments by all the envious folks. I am from MN and have hunted private property for 30 years and never saw deer like this. This year, in 2011, I paid an outfitter to gain access to the wonderful trophy land of SE MN. Fair chase. No fences. No gaurantees. Sat for three days – a total of 30 hours and never saw a deer. Day four shot a huge 162 eight pointer. Amazed at how many people discount it for paying an outfitter. The ONLY conclusion is jealousy. They PAY too on taxes for hunting private land. They also see nothing wrong with bragging about the 10 lb. walleye caught on a trip to Canada via an outfitter but do the same thing for deer and it's all of a sudden not fair. Screw all you jealous morons. I'm hooked and will keep paying an outfitter instead of the state via property taxes and don't care what your mediocre mind thinks. Congrats on a great WILD deer shot on unfenced land with no gaurantees

  • bucdoc 160

    o.k. everybody lets pack up and head to SOUTHEAST MN. we'll see how you like it when thousands of want-a-be hunters come stomping in on you spot, waving dollars around and acting like a bunch dickheads sceaming yee-haw we got money , now we can for once in our lives shoot a big one

    • Darrell

      It's not Southeast mn that I'm talking about It's minneapolis St.paul metro area 601

    • billybobahole

      I live in a state where the salmon and steel head fishing ranks right up there. We have people come from all over the country. And pay a lot of money to share our resources. And in over 35 yrs of rubbing elbows with these folks. Not once have I ever heard any residents or locals, say a damn thing. Or complain because people pay good money to go on charters and catch trophy size fish. Maybe you should just go around and blame farmers and landowners for leasing their properties out? Say hey farmer dude thanks for creating quite a few of the biggest bucks in the country for what, the last 30 or 40 yrs. But now that you don't allow free loaders like me to hunt your property. And your trying to pay your taxes and get some financial gain off YOUR PROPERTY. Well farmer Brown you suck a fat one. You have just as good if not a better chance at some of these bruisers. You live there? And I'm sure that several monsters are shot all over your state every season. To be honest I'd rather hunt SE Ohio, Wisconsin, Canada, or Kentucky anyway. Public ground or private lands. No high fences. No guides. And avoid douchebag residents that think they own the deer?? The best and only good thing that has ever come out of Illinois is the best football team in the NFL. My beloved BEARS!! The deer hunting? You jealous and selfish residents can keep it! Oh I forgot the black hawks. And thanks for Obama. He's for the hunter for sure I think?? Nope wrong guy. Randy, killer buck!!! Those are not juiced up bucks or pen reared. Free ranging bucks. If I were ever to hunt there. I would find some public land near one of their leases for sure. Do some scouting and piss the locals off. And I'd be on a working mans budget. Well this novel is over.

  • Darrell

    I can tell you that here in minnesota if you can obtain permission to hunt the metro area you can shoot monster bucks fair chase …I pay land owners to hunt their properties, they are not managed for bigbucks they roam wild and free, as long as they have no fences I'm agreeing that it's fair chase!!!!!

    • bucdoc 160

      i paid. that is so weak. give that farmer a hand with some of his chores, he'd like that more.

    • billybobahole

      On my way ,not a vikes fan. But met some cool people from Minnesota . They spoke of some giants roaming around.

  • jason anderson

    Nice deer I know how you feel I shot 21 pointer 215 and all the haters come out just remember its on your wall

  • Larry

    Ignorance is bliss!! The man shot the buck with a bow. Most of you commenting probably don't even live in Illinois. I DO! Whether this buck was fenced or not, a bow kill is ALWAYS something special! Say what you may but ALL deer have their instincts, same as people talking about being "tamed." You people make me sick! Congratulations Randy! No one can take the adrenaline rush or excitement or THE MEAT you harvest from you!! Shoot Straight!!

    • Right

      "Adrenaline rush"……what a DA. Most true hunters wouldn't want this deer on their wall if someone else had "helped" them get it. It's not a true trophy. It's a very nice buck…..but not a trophy by any stretch of the imagination.

      • bucdoc 160

        well put !

  • Chris

    Wow, not the deer but the comments. We live in Southern IL and own/farm/control around 1000 acres. The problem we have is this is over several farms from 300-50 acres each spread out over 1/2 of the county. We do not outfit or guide and there are 3 of us that hunt it and we will not shoot a buck under 150. The problems we have had over the years are numerous and come mostly from the same type of people that are bashing him for hunting with an outfitter. We have ran into people trespassing because they do not think it is fair that we control so much ground. We have neighbors that cannot understand why they cannot kill a true trophy and then shoot the first little 8 point they see. We have on numerous occasions found people set up right on the fence line with no opportunity for a shot except into our field. I can go one forever. The biggest problem we have though is the guys that have no common sense about management of a deer herd. If all of our land was in one big chunk then there would be no problem but with it spread out we cannot get the neighbors to let a buck actually mature to 4-6 years old. So before you bash him and the outfitter look at yourself and realize why you cannot get a deer of this quality and understand the only thing these guys are doing different is controlling a big enough chunk of land to allow the animals to mature.

  • concerned

    I've been hunting 36 years and enjoy the sport more than just about anything. I hunt to enjoy the outdoors not to bag a deer or other animal, though I have bagged many and some big ones on both private and public land. I'm concerned about where the sport of hunting is headed. Back in the day you didn't worry about food plots, genetics, year round scouting, trail cameras, mineral supplements, or fancy gear. You simply went hunting and if you bagged a big buck it meant something. You now read how this big buck was spotted then all the events and time that went into bagging the buck. It's a little obsessive, don't you think. All that just to say I have a deer in the record books (so what!!!). They are a few thousand dollars a dozen these days. Everyone is wondering why our youth is turning away from hunting, maybe it's because it's not as fun as it used to be when a big buck (maybe not a record) might be on the next ridge, not in Illinois. You guys need to think about this if you want future generations to experience the same out of hunting as you have.

  • Brandon

    Great buck. Props to the outfitter for working to build a quality buck like that. But for the hunter, I have more respect for a 12 year old who shoots his/her first deer with a bow. Don't get me wrong I would love to have chance to hunt with an outfitter and harvest a 200 inch buck, but you go out sit a few minutes and bam, your done.

  • Mike F

    You guys are clueless! QDMA! I bet half the fags on here that bad mouth QDMA don't even know what that is! I wouldn't be upset with the people that have learned to manage and grow big deer from the ground up! The right food, cover, management skills and culling the bad genetics is what gives that piece of property the chance to grow deer of that type! I personally know Randy, guess what's he is doing right now? He just got done with his 6 month long trip to South Dakota, Iowa, Illinois, and finally Kansas with Stan Potts and Don kiskey. Randy is one of the three hunters hunting with a chance to become a pro with North American whitetail! That's right hunt for a living! He and the 2 other contestants had 6 months starting in July to go to each location, gain permission on private Property in each state, anywhere in the state that was legal to hunt, look at google earth, select areas, scout, put together a hit list with trail cams and harvest the best buck he could with a maximum of one per state! Well he did and he let two arrows fly, one in Illinois and one in Iowa! This is free range, all scouted and hunted specific deer, to his credit he downed a 8 year old 188 b/c in Iowa and a 6 year old 179 b/c in Illinois! They get scored on video footage, age of the deer and preparation and plan execution to kill the deer! The only other hunter close only killed one 165! I'd say this guy is on his way to becoming a whitetail hunter for a living, but I'm sure all you belly aching retards that think he just hunt where the guide puts him would turn that down! You all that bash Randy could not hold his jock strap and are a small pimple on his rear end!

    Chew on that for a while!

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